NERF SIMBA OR BUFF OTHER DEFENSE CHARACTERS?

xantophyllxantophyll Registered Users, Member 16 Posts
edited May 15 in Suggestions & Feedback
Simba seems to be undefeatable because of his passive, wherein he gains defense per missing health. I bet this character only can stand and win against a full squad.

Comments

  • KoreanStepmomKoreanStepmom Registered Users, Member 55 Posts
    ^this I agree with 100%. All those people that dropped extensive sums of cash to get him to six or seven stars are the only ones who won't be complaining about this. Everyone else will agree that Simba is a tremendous nuisance who only caters to the delusional players that think spending money makes them skilled.
  • DullaranDullaran Registered Users, Member 32 Posts
    ^this I agree with 100%. All those people that dropped extensive sums of cash to get him to six or seven stars are the only ones who won't be complaining about this. Everyone else will agree that Simba is a tremendous nuisance who only caters to the delusional players that think spending money makes them skilled.
    I disagree. I don't use simba, mine isn't strong and I'm not in favor of changing it

    Currently defensive characters are useless in the game, they are all in the worst category on any tier list. Simba and mordu are the only ones who save, they are good for something. I want to buff the other defensive characters so that they can do their job: defend. Today the PVP and tournament is the same: a full damage team (without any defensive and supportive characters), why are there support and defensive characters then?

    there are only 2 usable defensive characters, one good (mor'du) and the other ok (simba). And you want that nerf? No way. preserve the strategy of the game, keep the two as they are and buff the others defensive characters: this way we can see more varied teams with new strategies
  • xantophyllxantophyll Registered Users, Member 16 Posts
    Dullaran said:
    ^this I agree with 100%. All those people that dropped extensive sums of cash to get him to six or seven stars are the only ones who won't be complaining about this. Everyone else will agree that Simba is a tremendous nuisance who only caters to the delusional players that think spending money makes them skilled.
    I disagree. I don't use simba, mine isn't strong and I'm not in favor of changing it

    Currently defensive characters are useless in the game, they are all in the worst category on any tier list. Simba and mordu are the only ones who save, they are good for something. I want to buff the other defensive characters so that they can do their job: defend. Today the PVP and tournament is the same: a full damage team (without any defensive and supportive characters), why are there support and defensive characters then?

    there are only 2 usable defensive characters, one good (mor'du) and the other ok (simba). And you want that nerf? No way. preserve the strategy of the game, keep the two as they are and buff the others defensive characters: this way we can see more varied teams with new strategies
    Totally makes sense! Thank you for sharing your thoughts. 
  • CTRatCTRat Registered Users, Member 13 Posts
    Dullaran said:
    ^this I agree with 100%. All those people that dropped extensive sums of cash to get him to six or seven stars are the only ones who won't be complaining about this. Everyone else will agree that Simba is a tremendous nuisance who only caters to the delusional players that think spending money makes them skilled.
    I disagree. I don't use simba, mine isn't strong and I'm not in favor of changing it

    Currently defensive characters are useless in the game, they are all in the worst category on any tier list. Simba and mordu are the only ones who save, they are good for something. I want to buff the other defensive characters so that they can do their job: defend. Today the PVP and tournament is the same: a full damage team (without any defensive and supportive characters), why are there support and defensive characters then?

    there are only 2 usable defensive characters, one good (mor'du) and the other ok (simba). And you want that nerf? No way. preserve the strategy of the game, keep the two as they are and buff the others defensive characters: this way we can see more varied teams with new strategies

    Defense characters (apart from those two) aren't "useless." Taunts are overall pretty strong in that they protect the rest of a team while they do their thing (and from what I see, gear and everything else equal, the characters are at least typically able to survive long enough for the taunt to get its full effect)... so yes, they can defend. Things are a bit lop-sided right now so offense is generally king, but I still see most of the teams in the high ranks of the tournament (in my server, anyway) use one, so I would think that at least means they're not "useless." And yes, I see several strong tanks around other than those two. Jasmine's pretty good on the meta kingdom teams, for instance.

    I wouldn't be against a re-balancing in general so that (currently weaker) defense characters overall have more weight to throw around apart, with their other attacks apart from their taunts. But they shouldn't need broken, OP defensive mechanics to get that balance. And a passive that can nearly triple (or when upgraded, more than quadruple???) their already high defense stat is OP. At least as far as I'm aware, there aren't other characters that can become absolute brick wall... well except maybe one in particular.

    I mean come on, it's bad enough that there's an invincible shirtless dude I have to deal with in the club dungeon, I don't need invincible lions, too.
  • DullaranDullaran Registered Users, Member 32 Posts
    CTRat said:
    Taunts are overall pretty strong in that they protect the rest of a team while they do their thing (and from what I see, gear and everything else equal, the characters are at least typically able to survive long enough for the taunt to get its full effect)... so yes, they can defend
    Until recently no one used a tank other than mor'du (in endgame) or gaston/simba (mid-game). With the launch of The Incredibles this changed a little. The tank mechanics are easy to counter, since the meta is full of characters with high area damage and speed (like hades, jack, judy, bbw) and the magic considered top tier is "foul play" (which steals buffs and taunt - every **** person in a endgame has that, I see the same thing all the time). 

    Remembering that they are very slow (the turn comes after everyone attacks, depending on the character he attacks 2 times before the tank). The tank is only able to protect with the taunt after the most important character has died (with the exception of Mr. Incredible, since the taunt comes from the passive).

    CTRat said:
    Jasmine's pretty good on the meta kingdom teams, for instance.
    Jasmine isn't good, she is what the guy currently has or likes to use (just like me, because aladdin is part of my childhood, i started playing this game just because i saw him). There are several characters that can make a lot more difference in a PvP. Even though it is not the kingdom type to take advantage of the shan-yu passive

    The tier is usually composed of 3 categories of usable characters, 1 of situational characters and 2 categories of horrible characters in which you need to run from them. Mor'du is in the first category, incredible sir in the second, simba in the third (the worst among usable ones) and all the others are distributed among the other categories, with 100% of the characters in the worst category being support or defensive.
  • DullaranDullaran Registered Users, Member 32 Posts
    edited May 15
    Dullaran said:

    and the magic considered top tier is "foul play" (which steals buffs and taunt - every **** person in a endgame has that, I see the same thing all the time). 
    whenever I played taunt someone used foul play, it became so common that my taunt was more disturbing than helping me and I stopped using defensive characters for that. My taunt was always played on an enemy character different from the one I was focusing on, breaking my strategy

    50% of the people in the TOP 10 on my server have this magic in the tournament, and more people must have it and do not use it because it isn't a good defensive magic (it is to be used manually, ai doesn't know when and who to use) . I wanted to look at the top pvp, but I don't know how to see it
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  • DullaranDullaran Registered Users, Member 32 Posts
    edited May 16
    Simba seems to be undefeatable because of his passive, wherein he gains defense per missing health. I bet this character only can stand and win against a full squad.
    Totally makes sense! Thank you for sharing your thoughts. 
    Thanks for listening to me, but you don't need to change the title of the question for me LOL

    This is a cool place for everyone to expose your opinions. Let's make this game grow together, if every1 thinks that it's better for the game's health nerf the simba ... whatever. 
  • CTRatCTRat Registered Users, Member 13 Posts
    Dullaran said:
    CTRat said:
    Taunts are overall pretty strong in that they protect the rest of a team while they do their thing (and from what I see, gear and everything else equal, the characters are at least typically able to survive long enough for the taunt to get its full effect)... so yes, they can defend
    Until recently no one used a tank other than mor'du (in endgame) or gaston/simba (mid-game). With the launch of The Incredibles this changed a little. The tank mechanics are easy to counter, since the meta is full of characters with high area damage and speed (like hades, jack, judy, bbw) and the magic considered top tier is "foul play" (which steals buffs and taunt - every **** person in a endgame has that, I see the same thing all the time). 

    I'm not sure where you're getting this from (the "no one used a tank other than...") -- maybe you are looking at things only strictly competitively, whereas I try my best to ignore the meta and make use of characters without worrying about it (with some success). But I'm still inclined to disagree on Jasmine -- I still see high-ranking teams in the tournament (in the top 10) with her (and get beat by teams with her, here and there, too).. correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel like when you're that high up there, your characters are probably pretty good. As for Simba, I only have a problem with Simba's passive because it doesn't seem fair for his numbers to go so so incredibly high when he's really low on health. If the numbers weren't so insane, but maybe still gave him more utility in other ways, then I wouldn't mind so much.

    Anyway, I overall agree with the sentiment that tanks are easily countered (especially on account of being so slow) and classes other than offense need more viability in competitive play. I'm not sure what the best way to do that would be (though I think supports need love the most, especially since heals are not as valuable in faster-paced PvP battles), other than maybe just them not being so slow. I definitely feel the pain of my tank's speed against the kingdom teams, where he'll pretty commonly be sitting through enemies getting multiple turns before he ever gets one.

    I personally am not really a fan of the idea to make tanks always able to reliably defend, though (like Mr. Incredible). The downside to making tanks able to constantly defend is that it reinforces the meta of high-damage AoE characters to work around it (so I imagine you would see even more of Hades, Mickey, BBW, etc.), because AoE nukes might become effectively the only way to play against it.

    ... Well, not considering Fowl play. Fowl play I think is a whole other issue -- I don't know why it does so much more damage than other "flanking" spells, or why it charges faster, it definitely seems like it could use a nerf. (I suppose one point to be made is that using Fowl play to steal a taunt can occasionally hurt you, as there's a chance it can give it to your highest-DPS character... but that usually is still a small price to pay).
  • DullaranDullaran Registered Users, Member 32 Posts
    CTRat said:
    But I'm still inclined to disagree on Jasmine -- I still see high-ranking teams in the tournament (in the top 10) with her (and get beat by teams with her, here and there, too).. 
    Yes, I am looking in the competitive mode. In my tournament I haven't found 1 jasmine in a long time, no one uses it. And if you look at guides and places where people come together to talk about the characters, jasmine is not in a good "position". But as I said, looking competitively

    CTRat said:
    I'm not sure where you're getting this from (the "no one used a tank other than...")
    From videos, gameplay, reddit, discord, watching the top players and their experience. After all, beta players are the only ones with characters equipped with sorcerer stones. And they are the ones who know what makes the difference at higher levels. Mor'du is weak at first, but his equipment makes him much stronger in the end.

    And watching my game too, as I am rising and growing I don't see these characters anymore.  I used to see jasmine all the time, now there are no more people using it. Even my team got a lot stronger when I took her out (as a child I loved seeing Aladdin, it took a long time for me to draw strength and get her out of my team T.T)

    CTRat said:
    I only have a problem with Simba's passive because it doesn't seem fair for his numbers to go so so incredibly high when he's really low on health. If the numbers weren't so insane, but maybe still gave him more utility in other ways, then I wouldn't mind so much.
    If they give him any other use he would be happy too. I wouldn't mind removing that passive, or modifying it and giving him something else. I would be sad if they nerf one of the few usable defensive characters without giving anything back, then he will become one of the many support / defend in limbo

    CTRat said:
    so I imagine you would see even more of Hades, Mickey, BBW, etc.), because AoE nukes might become effectively the only way to play against it.
    But that is the current meta, Hades is considered an essential character. And right after him is Mickey, BBW, Judy Hopes, Jack Sparrow due to AoE. People who don't know the meta yet, the game was released globally not long ago, but unfortunately it is already like that.

    CTRat said:
    (I suppose one point to be made is that using Fowl play to steal a taunt can occasionally hurt you, as there's a chance it can give it to your highest-DPS character... but that usually is still a small price to pay).
    This is not even a problem, unless you have a defensive character to use taunt they are probably focusing on your highest dps. So it doesn't change anything, it even helps not to use a charm or stum on another character strategically

    You said your point, and I liked it. I only ask the dsa team not to put a nerf on the simba without giving something in return to keep it balanced 
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